Are Fundamentals Finally Bullish?

Watch on YouTube ↗  |  April 21, 2025 at 23:55  |  55:02  |  1000x Podcast
Speakers
Avi Felman — Principal, GoldenTree Asset Management
Jonah Van Bourg — Head of Trading, Cumberland / ex-Vitol

Summary

Avi Felman and Jonah Van Bourg discuss a market rotation out of equities into gold and Bitcoin, with gold ripping and Bitcoin showing relative strength. They debate Saylor and MicroStrategy risk, MSTR copycat Bitcoin treasury companies, underpriced Bitcoin options, and a selective alt season focused on revenue-generating projects. Other topics include Hyperliquid's buyback model, TAO subnets, Curve valuation, and the hosts' upcoming 1000x terminal.

  • Gold and Bitcoin are decoupling from equities as allocators seek alternatives.
  • Saylor and MicroStrategy aggressive buying raises risk concerns.
  • MSTR copycat private placements may create a Bitcoin flow dynamic.
  • Bitcoin options tails look cheap to the hosts.
  • A selective alt season is favored over a broad alt rally, with ETH weak.
  • Hyperliquid, TAO subnets, and Curve are discussed as niche opportunities.
  • The hosts are building a 1000x terminal product.
Ideas
Avi Felman Principal, GoldenTree Asset Management 1:04
Avoid equities amid reallocation selloff.
Avi sees the current equity decline as a dangerous reallocation selloff rather than a uniform deleveraging: equities are grinding lower while gold and Bitcoin rise, which is scarier for equity holders. He says the market is terrified of holding equities and that fear is reasonable given the environment.
Avi Felman Principal, GoldenTree Asset Management 1:55
Long gold as state-independent reserve asset.
Avi says he shifted his portfolio into gold and remains giggle bullish because in a multipolar world assets not tied to a state become more valuable. The PBOC is divesting US securities and buying gold, the dollar is weakening, and allocators seeking alternatives to equities have few options besides gold, creating a durable bid.
Jonah Van Bourg Head of Trading, Cumberland / ex-Vitol 4:15
Bitcoin decouples from equities as digital gold.
Jonah argues gold is previewing Bitcoin: allocators are spooked by the equity selloff and, after maxing out gold, need another decorrelated asset. Bitcoin is showing relative strength versus Nasdaq and decoupling from equities, so if it proves it can act as an institutional equities hedge, flows into a much smaller asset could become silly.
Avi Felman Principal, GoldenTree Asset Management 8:34
Avoid MicroStrategy due to Saylor debt risk.
Avi is uncomfortable with Saylor and MicroStrategy buying all the way down; the average purchase price is now near $70k, which he calls scary and too much of the market. He says if the underlying business can service debt, Saylor may not be stopped out, but such financial-engineering-driven structures often end badly, so MicroStrategy is unattractive and risky.
Jonah Van Bourg Head of Trading, Cumberland / ex-Vitol 9:56
Watch Metaplanet copycat Bitcoin treasury private placements.
Jonah highlights a trade institutions see via private placements in MicroStrategy competitors. Metaplanet in Japan is buying Bitcoin aggressively, is the world's 10th-largest corporate holder, targets 21,000 BTC by 2026, and trades at a large premium to NAV after private placements. He thinks such private placements are reasonably good trades but has no take on buying the open-market stock, making it a monitorable setup.
Avi Felman Principal, GoldenTree Asset Management 20:41
Buy underpriced Bitcoin call options.
Avi thinks Bitcoin tails are underpriced: end-year IV in the mid-50s is low versus the potential for a fast institutional and sovereign-driven move. He specifically likes BTC Dec 31 $170k calls around $3k and June 27 $100k calls around $3.5k, suggesting large upside if Bitcoin moves to $100k-$120k, and says IBIT calls are a liquid alternative.
Avi Felman Principal, GoldenTree Asset Management 24:03
Short ETH, long quality revenue-generating altcoins.
Avi expects a selective alt season limited to a small group of real-revenue projects. He wants to short ETH against long positions in Pendle, Hyperliquid, and Bittensor/TAO, thinking these can have option-like upside and outperform ETH over six months as the market separates wheat from chaff.
Avi Felman Principal, GoldenTree Asset Management 24:03
Short ETH, long quality revenue-generating altcoins.
Avi owns Hyperliquid and views it as the best business in crypto: an exchange that returns 95%+ of fee profits via token buybacks, with fees equal to revenue, around $7M/day 7-day revenue, and a P/E roughly in line with Nasdaq. It is anti-fragile, benefits from volatility, and the buyback is reflexive; he may scale out around $25-$30 but has not sold.
Avi Felman Principal, GoldenTree Asset Management 24:03
Short ETH, long quality revenue-generating altcoins.
Avi expects a selective alt season limited to a small group of real-revenue projects. He wants to short ETH against long positions in Pendle, Hyperliquid, and Bittensor/TAO, thinking these can have option-like upside and outperform ETH over six months as the market separates wheat from chaff.
Jonah Van Bourg Head of Trading, Cumberland / ex-Vitol 34:20
Avoid ETH as broken revenue narrative.
Jonah argues ETH has broken investor trust: people realized ETH could be a seven-year pump-and-dump, it was deflationary only briefly, stopped making substantial money, and then fell sharply. He says he cannot buy anything unless it makes money, so ETH is now an avoid.
Jonah Van Bourg Head of Trading, Cumberland / ex-Vitol 43:06
Long Curve as stablecoin fee beneficiary.
Jonah says Curve is a real fee-generating protocol that passes value back to holders and should be a general winner, especially if stablecoins heat up and users move to Curve as a trading venue. Valuation is less attractive at around $1.3B FDV and 167x P/E, so the edge is less clear.
Up Next

This 1000x Podcast video, published April 21, 2025, features Avi Felman, Jonah Van Bourg discussing QQQ, SPY, GLD, BTC, MSTR, Metaplanet, BTC Dec 31 $170k call options, BTC Jun 27 $100k call options, IBIT calls, TAO, PENDLE, HYPE, ETH, CRV. 11 trade ideas extracted by AI with direction and confidence scoring.

Speakers: Avi Felman, Jonah Van Bourg  · Tickers: QQQ, SPY, GLD, BTC, MSTR, Metaplanet, BTC Dec 31 $170k call options, BTC Jun 27 $100k call options, IBIT calls, TAO, PENDLE, HYPE, ETH, CRV